tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post4248309130029523746..comments2023-10-31T05:08:39.383-04:00Comments on Yapping About YA: Nonhuman Viewpoint CharactersYapping About YAhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11249807348733979046noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-51871223410602642192009-11-20T05:22:00.421-05:002009-11-20T05:22:00.421-05:00Who knows where to download XRumer 5.0 Palladium? ...Who knows where to download XRumer 5.0 Palladium? <br />Help, please. All recommend this program to effectively advertise on the Internet, this is the best program!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-48773238736241490202008-01-14T16:18:00.000-05:002008-01-14T16:18:00.000-05:00I wanted to comment on a very well done non-human ...I wanted to comment on a very well done non-human character, and that was the dog in Elsewhere by Gabrielle Zevin. The story starts out with the dog of the deceased girl. I thought this was an ingenious way to start the book, though if it hadn't been well done, it could easily have been off-putting. <BR/><BR/>Great post, Hap!bethany griffinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14837470719905329431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-70117318717280108352008-01-12T22:35:00.000-05:002008-01-12T22:35:00.000-05:00I don't think it's as hard as it seems. I mean, th...I don't think it's as hard as it seems. I mean, the harpy was only my third character ever in long-form fiction (and the first I wrote at age 12, and the second at age 15). The trick is to make the thought processes match the character...just like with any other character.<BR/><BR/>Like, she's a harpy, right? Her entire existence has been following orders, torturing some bad people and being completely isolated from any and all dilemmas for...millions of years. She thinks simply, even about tough things, because she's simple. It's all just a reflection of itself, I guess.<BR/><BR/>And Haph, you gave me an idea for my next post.Vanessa Concannonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04635599300208678468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-43590767380231063202008-01-12T21:31:00.000-05:002008-01-12T21:31:00.000-05:00I know I've never written with a non-human viewpoi...I know I've never written with a non-human viewpoint just because I don't think I could make it real enough. And I think that's why a lot of writers stay away--they're afraid that a reader won't be able to relate to them as much as a human character.althrasherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08808839812646862405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-25880213212931389192008-01-12T20:21:00.000-05:002008-01-12T20:21:00.000-05:00Great post, Haph. I love me some nonhuman POV char...Great post, Haph. I love me some nonhuman POV characters. And while yes, they tend to have very human qualities, they're also very not. One of my MCs is a harpy--pretty humanoid, but also with a weird sense of duty leftover from her listening to orders days. A few of my POV characters are gods, also pretty humanoid, but also very different...like how they don't have anyone to please but themselves. Lots of power and no one to answer to, you know?<BR/><BR/>And so they show parts of our humanity, through mirrors or whatever, that are tougher to show using a human character. It's not commentary, it's not allegory, but it's also not fluff--my stories, I think, show the same things as a regular old romance or a regular old mother/daughter story, or whatever. But because the characters aren't human, they show slightly different aspects of humanity.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, yea, Haph, good post.Vanessa Concannonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04635599300208678468noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-14985278529622215152008-01-12T18:24:00.000-05:002008-01-12T18:24:00.000-05:00Sure, but it can be more than allegory.It can be h...Sure, but it can be more than allegory.<BR/><BR/>It can be humor (also common), it can just be an experiment, rather than just saying something about the world.<BR/><BR/>A lot of Sci-Fi started out as being allegory, and then Space Opera formed and now there's soft and hard and symbolic and fluff. I'd like to see more fluff from nonhuman viewpoints, where not everything is commentary.<BR/><BR/>If I'm making any sense.Haphazardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00759556520156326781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-34816852118634358502008-01-12T18:21:00.000-05:002008-01-12T18:21:00.000-05:00"Who says our mundane world can't be just as wondr..."Who says our mundane world can't be just as wondrous and strange to a nonhuman viewpoint?"<BR/><BR/>That would fall into the same sort of category as having a nonhuman POV be a commentary on human nature, which is a common Sci-fi/fantasy bit of advice that I did mention.Sagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14506653057750530404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-49627504284172283272008-01-12T18:17:00.000-05:002008-01-12T18:17:00.000-05:00Sagers, I've never believed in introductions to st...Sagers, I've never believed in introductions to stories, whether that be for better or for worse. I don't think the reader has to be eased into things, so I've never seen the point of these characters that are just there to be explained to.<BR/><BR/>But, I see your argument about wonder and raise you another. Who says our mundane world can't be just as wondrous and strange to a nonhuman viewpoint? In fact, I think it'd be more interesting to see our world from an outside viewpoint than their world from a 'human' (see 'typical reader's') viewpoint.Haphazardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00759556520156326781noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-9030748503735929062008-01-12T18:08:00.000-05:002008-01-12T18:08:00.000-05:00I've definitely heard the argument in the SF/F com...I've definitely heard the argument in the SF/F community about humanizing "alien" races. You know, the why is every alien on Star Trek a variation on humans (I realize they explained that in Star Trek, but still) question. I can see both sides of the argument. On one hand it's ridiculous to assume that every intelligent race, whether fantastical or off in space, would look, think, or act anything like humans. Then again, it *is* easier to identify with characters somewhat similar to yourself.<BR/><BR/>So what I hear a lot in Sci-fi, at least, is that if you're going to go from a non-human POV, you have to be saying something about human nature with it.<BR/><BR/>I don't know if it's really necessary, but that's just what I hear.<BR/><BR/>Really, I think the hardest part about it would be integrating the reader into the world. Because to the nonhuman character, the world is normal, so there's no reason for them to make a big deal of things that would be a big deal to a human. That's why you get a lot of stories of regular humans (or people who thought they were regular humans) being taken introduced to other worlds from the human's POV (HP, Narnia, Doctor Who, for example). Because as they learn so does the audience. But if you're going from the POV of Doctor Who or Dobby the House Elf, well, they've always been doing that stuff, so it's not so wondrous anymore. That's not to say that the reader can't figure it out as they go along. It's just more difficult.<BR/><BR/>Which is only a bad thing if you're not up to the challenge, of course ;)Sagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14506653057750530404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7514182676527520719.post-48640824208338843912008-01-12T16:04:00.000-05:002008-01-12T16:04:00.000-05:00Viewpoint is one of the most important things a wr...Viewpoint is one of the most important things a writer must consider, since it determines just how the reader is going to approach the world.<BR/><BR/>The same story is so much different when told by--instead of the girl who falls in love with the boy--the guy who brings them their ice cream sundaes every weekend and watches as they fall in love.<BR/><BR/>The same story is even more different if it's told by her dog. Especially if she no longer has time to play with the dog, now that she has a steady boyfriend.<BR/><BR/>Writers really shouldn't be afraid of different POVs, I agree. They open up so many possibilities it's insane. I've never written from a truly non-human POV, but now I think I might...Jordanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00850682345777206863noreply@blogger.com